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Anyone into playing with HyperV / Vmware?

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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 11:15 - 06 Feb 2017    Post subject: Anyone into playing with HyperV / Vmware? Reply with quote

Picked up an utter bargain off eBay.

Dell R900 2U Server - £119

2 x 73Gb SAS - RAID0 for OS
64Gb Ram
4 x 6 core 2.3Ghz HT Xeon CPU - 24 effective cores
Dual 900W PSU
4 port PCIE intel NIC

Added for another £160

Matrox G550 card - no Server 2012 drivers for ATI ES1000.
4 x 146Gb SAS HS discs - set as RAID5 for data / VM disks
64Gb RAM


Runs a treat! Ok it ain't the quietest of things sat under my desk but for a decent spec to run virtual machines with / crunch stuff / render stuff it's an utter bargain.

Been teaching myself HyperV, migrating machines, Veeam and all the associated gubbins that go with it.

Really surprised just how cheap good spec ex corporate stuff is, this would have been several thousand pounds not so long ago.
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 11:24 - 06 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use it at work, and have my eye on some old kit to "store offsite" Smile
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colink98
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PostPosted: 11:29 - 06 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Been using vMware for a while now.
VSP and VSTP certified.

you would have thought it was common place but in many SMEs they just don't have the experience or understanding to implement these things.

Starwinds offer their vSan software free for up to 2 nodes
[url]https://www.starwindsoftware.com/starwind-virtual-san?gclid=CN-v2Imu-9ECFcm87QodAYgKWg
[/url]

this is worth playing with as it gives you some idea of how to work with SANs and also tolerance / HA systems.

i assume your running 3.5 inch SAS drives...
Do you have any spare bays as i'm sure i have a few knocking about which came out of my back up server.
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 11:39 - 06 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinK98 wrote:
Been using vMware for a while now.
VSP and VSTP certified.

you would have thought it was common place but in many SMEs they just don't have the experience or understanding to implement these things.

Starwinds offer their vSan software free for up to 2 nodes
[url]https://www.starwindsoftware.com/starwind-virtual-san?gclid=CN-v2Imu-9ECFcm87QodAYgKWg
[/url]

this is worth playing with as it gives you some idea of how to work with SANs and also tolerance / HA systems.

i assume your running 3.5 inch SAS drives...
Do you have any spare bays as i'm sure i have a few knocking about which came out of my back up server.


Yes - sadly all the bays are now full. However given the price, i am considering adding a Dell MD1000 to give me an extra bit of redundancy / noise / office heating as these are changing hands for < £200 with 73Gb drives in them.

I'll take a look at the Starwinds thing thanks, decided it's more fun / more productive to teach myself than to wait for someone else to offer the training.

First hurdle passed was setting up 2012 Server on a laptop, creating the 4 2012 VM i needed then realising that 'moving' these machines is a complete ballache compared to simply exporting them to the new server once i'd built it.

None of it looks massively complicated unless you're really digging under the surface.
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colink98
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PostPosted: 12:29 - 06 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

UncleBFester wrote:

None of it looks massively complicated unless you're really digging under the surface.


It isn't and don't let anyone tell you any different.

Much of the complexity you might come across will be due to people not really having a clean understanding of what they are doing and others peoples fear of contradicting them.

a clean and effective infrastructure is a pleasing thing, not unlike a decent bit of engineering.
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Serendipity
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PostPosted: 09:53 - 07 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

UncleBFester wrote:
Really surprised just how cheap good spec ex corporate stuff is, this would have been several thousand pounds not so long ago.


Tell me about it. I’ve seen stuff purchased (arguably foolishly) for £1million then tossed out 3 years later for £10,000! Just nuts.

I’ve got a couple of the HP Microservers, one G7 and one Gen8, but I tend to only mess with them when I’m studying for the next exam. Stupid 2 year expiry on the qualifications these days.

I spend my working days looking after a fair sized VMware virtual desktop environment so IT at home tends to take a back seat. The work environment is nudging 8000 desktops now. Managed by just 2 of us.

I’d like to run up the Nutanix Community Edition at home, but the Microservers are a little light on memory for that and I can’t really justify spending on more kit.
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Derivative
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PostPosted: 01:29 - 10 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

On my old desktop machine (6-core consumer, i7-5820K IIRC) I used to run qemu with a bunch of VMs for stuff like running Windows gaming side by side with Linux on a desktop machine. Nice and easy to back up VM images, etc.

Biggest concern for me at that price would be power usage. You could likely spend more than the capex annually on electricity if you nail it. Might not be a concern just something to be aware of (I got a vaguely accurate power meter for a tenner from amazon)
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 06:55 - 10 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh it's only on when I need to use it. I'm not daft lol
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linuxyeti
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PostPosted: 07:55 - 10 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Derivative wrote:
On my old desktop machine (6-core consumer, i7-5820K IIRC) I used to run qemu with a bunch of VMs for stuff like running Windows gaming side by side with Linux on a desktop machine. Nice and easy to back up VM images, etc.


I'd agree with the above, or even KVM, my own preference, there are some pretty neat gui's around now as well, or, if you want something ultra quick & simple to setup, VirtualBox is also worth looking at.

1 caveat with VirtualBox on Linux, if you have a efi boot, you have to do a bit of work with the kernel modules, using mokutil ..

Still, always something new to learn !! Smile
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TackledArchon
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PostPosted: 15:37 - 10 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, that Starwinds program is pretty good by the way. We're using their free version at work between our servers, and thanks to it, we didn't loose any our data after one of the servers went to Valhalla Very Happy

Cool thing is that our database kept running when that happened.
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Northern Monkey
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PostPosted: 18:30 - 10 Feb 2017    Post subject: Re: Anyone into playing with HyperV / Vmware? Reply with quote

UncleBFester wrote:
Picked up an utter bargain off eBay.

Dell R900 2U Server - £119

2 x 73Gb SAS - RAID0 for OS
64Gb Ram
4 x 6 core 2.3Ghz HT Xeon CPU - 24 effective cores
Dual 900W PSU
4 port PCIE intel NIC

Added for another £160

Matrox G550 card - no Server 2012 drivers for ATI ES1000.
4 x 146Gb SAS HS discs - set as RAID5 for data / VM disks
64Gb RAM


Runs a treat! Ok it ain't the quietest of things sat under my desk but for a decent spec to run virtual machines with / crunch stuff / render stuff it's an utter bargain.

Been teaching myself HyperV, migrating machines, Veeam and all the associated gubbins that go with it.

Really surprised just how cheap good spec ex corporate stuff is, this would have been several thousand pounds not so long ago.


It's all cheap because it's expensive when it goes wrong. It all gets chucked after 4 years.

Most Large Enterprises now consider their Virtual estate legacy, and the trend is to push stuff to managed public cloud.

Spend some time working out how to migrate machines between locally hosted VMs and AWS/Azure hosted via a few scripts then make £££££
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 12:35 - 14 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Long as you clean out the PSU of dust / replace the CPU thermal paste - these old things are pretty much bullet proof.

Parts are also cheap and plentiful if you know where to look. Of course that doesn't interest a datacentre but for a bit of light home tinkering, they're now perfect.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 13:44 - 14 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Serendipity wrote:

Tell me about it. I’ve seen stuff purchased (arguably foolishly) for £1million then tossed out 3 years later for £10,000! Just nuts.



There are 8 super spec'd blade servers in our farm, all still in their boxes all out of warranty all cost about 100k each. They were for a project that was cancelled. There were 10, but one of the network guys replaced the old ftp servers without telling anyone Laughing
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kawakid
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PostPosted: 20:18 - 14 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Use vmWare at work and have done for quite some time now.

Not really an expert at vmWare, my virtual servers run on there, with their storage on Netapp. Not a big setup about 30 vms in all. But these run on 3 physical servers.

I've just removed an ESX host, with 90 odd gb of ram. They tend to get left in the warehouse and then disposed of a few years after.
(Literally me and colleague removing HDs and borrowing a hard hat and glasses and a sledge hammer from facilities).

Never really thought of selling tbh. I often wonder what other firms do, owners would be pretty worried about data tbh. (even though it's all on the Netapp).

Now for some controversy I always preferred XenServer.
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t121anf
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PostPosted: 20:56 - 14 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Our old servers go to WEEE waste, hard drive removed and shredded on site.

Used VMware at home and work, stopped at home as I gained little from it.
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 10:37 - 16 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

2 down, 7 to go. Just because our DHCP is running on Server 2003, the "thou shalt not use an unsupported OS" rule means the NHS can spend way too much money on Dell PowerEdge R330's to replace the old kit.
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colink98
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PostPosted: 11:42 - 16 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Shaggy D.A. wrote:
2 down, 7 to go. Just because our DHCP is running on Server 2003, the "thou shalt not use an unsupported OS" rule means the NHS can spend way too much money on Dell PowerEdge R330's to replace the old kit.


And here we are trying to shine the shit out of workstations "which worked fine when we brought them" 3 years ago.

the simple logic of either you reduce the models to match the hardware or increase the hardware to match the models, is falling on deaf ears.

But Colin.....
We want all shitz but for none of the cost....
I nearly asked the boss if he was a scooterist....
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 13:39 - 16 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Use KVM with virsh at work. It's really nice to work with, a few bash scripts and some replication and any vm is available on any of the bare metal boxes. Used to use vmware but ditched it. KVM will use vmdk's so no problems moving.

Boxes are quite powerful 40 core E5-2650, mirrored SSDs for OS and db servers then lots and lots of disks in raid 6.

All this makes a big change from the shitty hardware we used to run it all on.

The biggest success in this was dd'ing a machine over ssh that hadn't been turned off for 8 years (and it was about 12 years old) and successfully starting it as a vm. Original box died and never came back. So much cheering and patting of self on back over the preemptive vm creation and no loss of service.
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wots
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PostPosted: 13:41 - 16 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Veeam, pretty much earns me the money to buy eleventy bikes.

Excellent product. Replicating VMWare between customer site and multiple datacentres.

Customers love it, bailed two customers out with ransomware attacks because of this, DR is bliss too. In the process of converting another customer over to this now.
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 14:02 - 16 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

Servers look awesome but they have small high speed fans that make a stupid amount of noise. I use an FX6300 and its near silent Confused

The Shaggy D.A. wrote:
2 down, 7 to go. Just because our DHCP is running on Server 2003, the "thou shalt not use an unsupported OS" rule means the NHS can spend way too much money on Dell PowerEdge R330's to replace the old kit.


Are those racks for a hospital or for an entire region?
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 14:52 - 16 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

3 main data centres, Northampton, Kettering and Wellingborough, about 50 sites dotted around Northamptonshire.
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UncleFester
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PostPosted: 20:31 - 16 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinK98 wrote:
The Shaggy D.A. wrote:
2 down, 7 to go. Just because our DHCP is running on Server 2003, the "thou shalt not use an unsupported OS" rule means the NHS can spend way too much money on Dell PowerEdge R330's to replace the old kit.


And here we are trying to shine the shit out of workstations "which worked fine when we brought them" 3 years ago.

the simple logic of either you reduce the models to match the hardware or increase the hardware to match the models, is falling on deaf ears.

But Colin.....
We want all shitz but for none of the cost....
I nearly asked the boss if he was a scooterist....


You can cheat a little by adding SSD or adding better GFX cards / RAM but ultimately yes, if you want to ramp up quality you have to get current hardware and 3 years is good going if you're at the cutting edge of rendering stuff.

The last 'proper' farm i built was 96 x 1u blades each with quad proc quad core xeons with 32Gb of ram each with 128Gb SSD in them - rendering output was damned good and quick but the cost of them took some arguing ..... until they saw what they could output in 1/5th the time and not having to use their workstations to render with.
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 01:28 - 17 Feb 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote

The speed improvements of this years chips over those of 4 years ago are pretty moderate.

https://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph9483/76275.png
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