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DVLA screwup`s on licences

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Tony12345
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PostPosted: 18:55 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: DVLA screwup`s on licences Reply with quote

Hi, on a serious note, has anyone or know anyone that has had problems with their driving licences, where DVLA have "lost" driver details and had categories removed?
I have flicked through 100`s of webpages and this seems to be a very common problem.
The most common is where people have passed their A entitlement only to find out at a later date, either through a licence renewal or change of details find out they have lost their entitlement where DVLA "seem to not have those details".
Has any one been able to recover their lost details from DVLA? And without having to retake the test allover again?

Our problem is my partner has found out after a non fault accident she does not have a driving licence. Though the licence she has was issued by DVLA. She passed her bike test back around 74 and car test around 77. So far we have spent hrs on the phone with DVLA
spread over the last 6 years and not getting anywhere. It turns out she as 3 driving licences that are issued by DVLA. From the info we managed to squeeze out of them, 2 licence`s the issue number is wrong, the 2nd licence had the wrong DoB in the driver number, it should be 03 month but says 55. From her licence she has her A licence is missing. We did manage to get info on her proper licence but states she only had a provisional driving licence and no motorbike licence. And shes been driving 40 years. The cock up seems to have happened when the new photo licence came out and she updated hers back in 2007.
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Rob W
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PostPosted: 19:53 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you tried this?

https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence

Should be able to tell you exactly what the DVLA have on record at least.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 19:59 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right your wife needs to do a Subject Access request under Data protection and state in it that you want details of all 3 Driving licenses and any other Ghost licenses that could possibly pertain to your wife
That last bit in bold is extremely important.
State that you also want copies of any information from the yearly snapshots of driver data of all three licenses and any additional licenses and any copies held on microfilm or any other media.

Ghost licenses are licenses that don't really exist. They are made when people who don't have licenses get points and also importantly in your wifes case they are oftem made by mistake and shadow peoples original license. For example a car driver passes an HGV test, accidently instead of being added to their license a new license is formed with just the HGV pass on it.

What this means is that there is a big chance one of these licenses was created when your wife passed each of her tests, can and Motorcycle.

Stop phoning DVLA unless you are recording the calls.

Once you get that I can advise you further.


Last edited by sickpup on 21:04 - 17 Aug 2018; edited 1 time in total
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 20:11 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
For example a car driver passes an HGV test, accidently instead of being added to their license a new license is formed with just the HGV pass on it.


That must be what happened to my dad years ago. The last test he passed was HGV1. Years later he sent off his license for some update or other and he got nothing back. When he queried it with DVLA they had no record of any license for him. He had his HGV license, and luckily he had a photocopy of his car and bike license (it was the only thing he could think of to test out his new printer/scanner/copier). He had to send off the copy of the license to get all his entitlements back.
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Tony12345
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PostPosted: 20:22 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob W wrote:
Have you tried this?

https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence

Should be able to tell you exactly what the DVLA have on record at least.

Hi rob, yep I found that website 3 weeks ago, mine and my stepsons licences come up with out errors, I found info useful as now on the plastic licence it doesn't show any provisional entitlement I have, this website gave me that extra info Smile.

This is the interesting part I entered the details of the plastic card she has and it comes up with no details, just the error saying wrong details entered. Now the plastic card shows an error on the month of birth as 55. I entered all the details again from the card but changed the 55 to 03 (month of birth no such date as the 55th month lol). It came up with "unable to retrieve data" or words to that description.
So was unable to get any info
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Tony12345
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PostPosted: 20:35 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
Right your wife needs to do a Subject Access request under Data protection and state in it that you want details of all 3 Driving licenses and any other Ghost licenses that could possibly pertain to your wife
That last bit in bold is extremely important.
State that you also want copies of any information from the yearly snapshots of driver data and any copies held on microfilm or any other media.

Ghost licenses are licenses that don't really exist. They are made when people who don't have licenses get points and also importantly in your wifes case they are oftem made by mistake and shadow peoples original license. For example a car driver passes an HGV test, accidently instead of being added to their license a new license is formed with just the HGV pass on it.

Stop phoning DVLA unless you are recording the calls.

Once you get that I can advise you further.

Thanks for info, I was running out of ideas on a work around, lol we will try that.
Searching for a resolution on line over several months found this site :-www.whatdotheyknow.com
found a search on some one else in the same boat, but just had the brush off from dvla, I made an application here :- https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/wrong_driving_licence_number_and
But I hit a brick wall aswell.

On another note I did find some gov info on dvla section that back a few years ago dvla used a 3rd party outside agency that was brought in to help with the back log, and this seems where dvla messed up as wrong details were entered by this 3rd party, and poeple that had passed their tests found out later dvla "had no info" on their pass.

Again il give your suggestion a bash see how far we get Very Happy.

P.S would it be better to go to the DVLA office? We have one in Peterborough, as a phone call they always say "we cant give details due to data protection"
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 21:21 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony12345 wrote:
Thanks for info, I was running out of ideas on a work around, lol we will try that.
Searching for a resolution on line over several months found this site :-www.whatdotheyknow.com
found a search on some one else in the same boat, but just had the brush off from dvla, I made an application here :- https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/wrong_driving_licence_number_and
But I hit a brick wall aswell.


You hit a brick wall as you did the wrong kind of request. You did an FOI request whereas you need to do a Subject access request.

Tony12345 wrote:
On another note I did find some gov info on dvla section that back a few years ago dvla used a 3rd party outside agency that was brought in to help with the back log, and this seems where dvla messed up as wrong details were entered by this 3rd party, and poeple that had passed their tests found out later dvla "had no info" on their pass.


Only partialy correct. DVLA have used outside staff for years on and off to clear back logs but this doesn't mean the problem was caused by one of them.

Tony12345 wrote:
P.S would it be better to go to the DVLA office? We have one in Peterborough, as a phone call they always say "we cant give details due to data protection"


No you don't EVER visit DVLA in person, you do EVERYTHING via writing with recorded delivery so you have a record.

Pete. wrote:
That must be what happened to my dad years ago. The last test he passed was HGV1. Years later he sent off his license for some update or other and he got nothing back. When he queried it with DVLA they had no record of any license for him. He had his HGV license, and luckily he had a photocopy of his car and bike license (it was the only thing he could think of to test out his new printer/scanner/copier). He had to send off the copy of the license to get all his entitlements back.


At a guess what happened to your father was subtley different. The chances are someone at DVLA wiped his license completely from the system. The license was recoverable due to the photo copies having a valid license No. but my belief is he realised before 3 months was up so there was still a copy on the system.
DVLA have yearly snapshots of the system but day to day they run a rolling 90 day backup. Once a record change hits 90 days it is overwritten so cannot be recalled UNLESS it is recorded in the yearly snapshot.

The reason to ask for microfilm copies is your wifes license predates DVLA and all information from back then was transferred to microfilm/microfiche.
This data certainly still exists, its in a warehouse in Morriston but some did get destroyed about a decade back in a fire.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 21:33 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
Right your wife needs to do a Subject Access request under Data protection and state in it that you want details of all 3 Driving licenses and any other Ghost licenses that could possibly pertain to your wife


Including but not limited to the 3 licenses you know of, Licenses with names similar to hers or DOBs similar to hers at any of here previous addresses. The Handover records from the taxation office to DVLA on or abouts October 1976 that should be on microfilm (very important).

I will try to think of anything else.
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matto
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PostPosted: 23:11 - 17 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony12345 wrote:
Rob W wrote:
Have you tried this?

https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence

Should be able to tell you exactly what the DVLA have on record at least.

Hi rob, yep I found that website 3 weeks ago, mine and my stepsons licences come up with out errors, I found info useful as now on the plastic licence it doesn't show any provisional entitlement I have, this website gave me that extra info Smile.

This is the interesting part I entered the details of the plastic card she has and it comes up with no details, just the error saying wrong details entered. Now the plastic card shows an error on the month of birth as 55. I entered all the details again from the card but changed the 55 to 03 (month of birth no such date as the 55th month lol). It came up with "unable to retrieve data" or words to that description.
So was unable to get any info


A female driver number has 5 added to the first number of the month of birth so yours should be 53. 55 would be a female born in may.
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Tony12345
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PostPosted: 07:29 - 18 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

matto wrote:

A female driver number has 5 added to the first number of the month of birth so yours should be 53. 55 would be a female born in may.


Hmm, I have made an error then on saying on here, I read the number wrong from memory, just checked her licence number lol. her licence she has says 553107 I thought it should say 503107
I did try the number on licence but came up with nothing just a typing error message, I typed in what I though should be the proper number but came up with unavailable to view.
So now in guessing the last part of the driver number is wrong.
I am guessing the last letters and numbers, are the initials of a persons name with some random numbers. Mine is AR*** and my partners is EA***.

Thanks for the heads up Very Happy
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RS65
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PostPosted: 08:59 - 18 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is what the licence number means:
Each driving licence holder in England, Scotland and Wales has a 16 character long, unique driver number. The characters are formulated in the following way:

CHARACTERS 1-5: These are the first five characters of the driver’s surname and if it’s less than five, it’s filled up with nines
CHARACTER 6: The decade digit from the year of birth. For example, 1993 would be 9
CHARACTERS 7-8: These are the month of birth, so December would be 12. For female drivers, the seventh character is incremented by a 5 – so 51-62 instead of 01-12
CHARACTERS 9-10: The date within the month of birth – this would be 01-31
CHARACTER 11: The year digit from the year of birth. For example, 1993 would be 3
CHARACTERS 12-13: The first two initials of the first names – if driver has no middle name, the character is replaced with a 9
CHARACTER 14: Random digit, typically 9
CHARACTERS 15-16: Two computer check digits
CHARACTERS 17-18: Appended, two digits representing the licence issue – increase by one for each licence issued
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Riejufixing
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PostPosted: 12:48 - 18 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:

DVLA have yearly snapshots of the system but day to day they run a rolling 90 day backup.


I am constantly amazed at what management in organisations such as the DVLA find acceptable. If 100% true, nothing added nor taken away, what they have there seems unacceptable.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 12:16 - 19 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are hugely incompetant. They misspelled my name for 12 years over 6 seperate driving licences.

I also submitted a logbook recording a change of colour of a motorcycle five times. Each time they sent a new one back with no change made and a standard letter saying they had checked the details and there was nothing wrong. I gave up in the end.

They also added a new owner to all of my vehicles when I moved house and informed them of my change of address. I did nothing abou tit because they are all old and clapped-out and unlikely to be sold for much when I'm finished with them.

For future reference, it may help someone, I personally do not return my old driving licences. I claim it was lost and pay the extra fee for the new one. I consider this as "insurance" in case they cock up. I still have every photocard licence I have been issued
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TaffyTDM
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PostPosted: 15:44 - 19 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
They are hugely incompetant. They misspelled my name for 12 years over 6 seperate driving licences.

I also submitted a logbook recording a change of colour of a motorcycle five times. Each time they sent a new one back with no change made and a standard letter saying they had checked the details and there was nothing wrong. I gave up in the end.

They also added a new owner to all of my vehicles when I moved house and informed them of my change of address. I did nothing abou tit because they are all old and clapped-out and unlikely to be sold for much when I'm finished with them.

For future reference, it may help someone, I personally do not return my old driving licences. I claim it was lost and pay the extra fee for the new one. I consider this as "insurance" in case they cock up. I still have every photocard licence I have been issued


Had the "new keeper" when changing address thing a few times. You have to sort it now with the new tax rules, i found out the latest time when my car got clamped by the roving anpr van overnight. Turns out when i moved, and was shown a new keeper, the tax refund cheque was sent to my old address and cancelled. Not my fault, but still ended up without use of the car for a couple of hours whilst it was sorted
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Tony12345
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PostPosted: 20:26 - 19 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:

For future reference, it may help someone, I personally do not return my old driving licences. I claim it was lost and pay the extra fee for the new one. I consider this as "insurance" in case they cock up. I still have every photocard licence I have been issued



That's what I do, who actually keeps their pass documents? Especially if you passed before 2000. I never did. The only pass documents I kept were when I got my hgv licence. Also I just got replacement licences when they needed upgrading or change of address,. I probably now have over 10 driving licences stuffed in a folder or draw lol. So there is now way they can tell me I don't have a licence.
Also is good advice to keep them as a backup.
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R1stu
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PostPosted: 13:41 - 20 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
sickpup wrote:
Right your wife needs to do a Subject Access request under Data protection and state in it that you want details of all 3 Driving licenses and any other Ghost licenses that could possibly pertain to your wife


Including but not limited to the 3 licenses you know of, Licenses with names similar to hers or DOBs similar to hers at any of here previous addresses. The Handover records from the taxation office to DVLA on or abouts October 1976 that should be on microfilm (very important).

I will try to think of anything else.


How do you know all of this?
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Wonko The Sane
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PostPosted: 16:00 - 20 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Tony12345"]
stinkwheel wrote:


That's what I do, who actually keeps their pass documents? Especially if you passed before 2000.


most people submit them to the DVLA who then destroy them, and then request them if you question the lack of an entitlement on your licence at a later date.

I have my bike ones from 2012 as the Department of Various Lost Articles cock-ups were starting to come to light - I was asked at the test centre if I wanted to send my licence off there and then, so I did, got handed my test certificates and counterpart and new photocard turned up (correct) in the post within a few weeks.

said test certificates and summary are tucked away safely just incase.
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peejayess
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PostPosted: 14:21 - 21 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

To y12345, are you looking for your wife’s documents under her married name or maiden name? Did she pass the test before marriage, did she update them after marriage? Just a thought ...
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 18:06 - 21 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

R1stu wrote:
How do you know all of this?


I am infamous at DVLA likely causing the job loss of one chief executive and costing them rather a lot of money in lost penalties.
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Wonko The Sane
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PostPosted: 16:16 - 24 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
R1stu wrote:
How do you know all of this?


I am infamous at DVLA likely causing the job loss of one chief executive and costing them rather a lot of money in lost penalties.


this sounds interesting...

well done
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dydey90
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PostPosted: 16:29 - 24 Aug 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
For future reference, it may help someone, I personally do not return my old driving licences. I claim it was lost and pay the extra fee for the new one. I consider this as "insurance" in case they cock up. I still have every photocard licence I have been issued


I do exactly the same off the back of similar threads and advice here. I've got all my pass certificates tucked away too.
I don't tell them it's lost though, just tick to say that I've destroyed it and sent them the pieces, then it gets filed with my paperwork. They never follow up.
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BusterGonads
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PostPosted: 01:05 - 02 Sep 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

By way of having an official copy of your license entitlements for future reference, if you use the DVLA website linked at the bottom of this post you can save a copy of the web page they present at the end of the process. I have a saved and archived copy showing all of my entitlements and the dates they run from like when I passed tests. The DVLA are notoriously shabby about how they do things. This won't help the OP with his wife's problem but it might give peace of mind to others in case of future fuck ups.

https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence
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ThatDippyTwat
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PostPosted: 18:14 - 02 Sep 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

tony1951 wrote:
might give peace of mind to others in case of future fuck ups


Unless you have an old license, you're shit out of luck. They wont accept anything else.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 19:19 - 02 Sep 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

In relation to Stinkwheel's post.
Unless I'm planning on selling a modified vehicle, I.e it's a keeper then I'd never bother to record a colour change, frame change or engine swap to either a lump with a different engine number or a conversion to a different type of engine or a capacity increase.

This isn't because I think it's cool to have a 1.25 Fiesta with a 2.0L engine fitted and not re-registering it as the bigger engine. Its because of the possibility of DVSA screw ups. Also as said if im keeping a vehicle indefinitely then I operate on 'my vehicle my rules' policy.

I've never had an insurance company ask me to re-record or register vehicle changes with the DVSA, they just want to know the changes so that they can quote accordingly.

I know that a small engine could be less tax than a bigger one, but again my vehicle and who else is going to know. By the same token what if you change the cams in your engine and it exceeds the emissions limits, what would you do then? The only vehicles I have that should have a catalytic converter but don't for the MOT, I always make sure that the tailpipe the probe is inserted into for the test has a working catalyst in the exhaust system.
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Fizzer Thou
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PostPosted: 15:06 - 05 Sep 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

A few years ago the BBC programme 'Watchdog' had a representative from the DVLA on and he was questioned by that ginger woman.He admitted that around 1% of people end up with lost details on their registration and driving documents.

That was some revelation as 1% of 26 million plus people with a driving licence is quite a large number Rolling Eyes

I have just looked up my details and for some reason I have lost my 'E' entitlement... Laughing
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