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Changing fork oil, top caps...

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EazyDuz
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PostPosted: 17:53 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Changing fork oil, top caps... Reply with quote

There must be an easier way of doing this than what I did today. I wanted to change the fork oil so:

1. Jack front end up so wheel is off the ground
2. Undo top caps with a towel over the top so they dont shoot into outer space
3. Used a vacuum pump to remove old oil, refilled with new stuff
4. Attempt to put top caps back on.

What a fukin nightmare. The main issues are:

- The springs stick out 2-3 inches
- The spring seats on the inner RIM of the top cap, so it slides off and goes flying far too easily
- The threads are very fine and made of butter

They look like this, but imagine on the underside there is about a 4mm wide rim in which the spring must sit flush on, while you push them down:

https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/323247794193_/2007-06-09-Suzuki-Vl800-C50-Boulevard-Fork-Caps.jpg

I did eventually do it, after 3 hours trying by myself before getting a second pair of hands, and even then it took several goes.
Are a lot of bikes designed this way or is this just a Suzuki thing? I hope I never have to take them off again and if I do i'll buy new ones because they're not in the best shape after so many failed attempts
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Islander
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PostPosted: 18:40 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Next time drop the forks out of the bike - it's much easier. Doing it that way you can hold the cap and compress the spring with one hand while you rotate the stanchion to catch the start of the thread with the other. Thumbs Up

ETA:

Also, the spring doesn't usually bear on the cap. There's the spring then a spring cap then usually a tubular spacer with the fork cap bearing on the top of the spacer.
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EazyDuz
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PostPosted: 18:48 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Islander wrote:
Next time drop the forks out of the bike - it's much easier. Doing it that way you can hold the cap and compress the spring with one hand while you rotate the stanchion to catch the start of the thread with the other. Thumbs Up


Well I'm both confused and concerned now. I looked in the Haynes and found this:

https://imgur.com/31Iwycd
https://imgur.com/bej6KHc

https://imgur.com/bej6KHc
https://imgur.com/31Iwycd



Granted it says on models 'so equipped'. But over on the US forum I've not seen anyone complain about getting the top caps back on which makes me think they all have this spring stopper on there. So why doesn't mine have that? And is it a bit dangerous having the continuous spring pressure, especially over speed bumps etc, pushing against the top cap with only 1cm of fine thread on it? I dont get why some bikes would have this retaining bolt under the cap and others not, other than to piss off the DIY mechanic.
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Robby
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PostPosted: 20:06 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you didn't take the forks off and pump out the old oil, you didn't get it all out.
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Islander
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PostPosted: 20:14 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robby wrote:
If you didn't take the forks off and pump out the old oil, you didn't get it all out.


There's that too...
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Islander
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PostPosted: 20:26 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

EazyDuz wrote:

Well I'm both confused and concerned now. I looked in the Haynes and found this:

https://imgur.com/31Iwycd
https://imgur.com/bej6KHc

https://imgur.com/bej6KHc
https://imgur.com/31Iwycd



Granted it says on models 'so equipped'. But over on the US forum I've not seen anyone complain about getting the top caps back on which makes me think they all have this spring stopper on there. So why doesn't mine have that? And is it a bit dangerous having the continuous spring pressure, especially over speed bumps etc, pushing against the top cap with only 1cm of fine thread on it? I dont get why some bikes would have this retaining bolt under the cap and others not, other than to piss off the DIY mechanic.


It really doesn't take that much effort to compress the spring and engage the thread, and the thread/cap arrangement is typical - it won't fail unless you're daft enough to cross thread it.

The reason it was hard was that you didn't drop the forks out of the clamps. Your forks are much the same arrangement as the ones in my 1200 Bandit and I've never had a problem with those Smile
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EazyDuz
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PostPosted: 20:34 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robby wrote:
If you didn't take the forks off and pump out the old oil, you didn't get it all out.


Delboys garage already proved that wrong. He drained one fork by turning it upside down and the other using a vacuum pump with a narrow tube, both removed the exact same amount.
Same with car oil from the dipstick hole, if you do it right you get it all out.
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Islander
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PostPosted: 20:53 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

EazyDuz wrote:
Robby wrote:
If you didn't take the forks off and pump out the old oil, you didn't get it all out.


Delboys garage already proved that wrong. He drained one fork by turning it upside down and the other using a vacuum pump with a narrow tube, both removed the exact same amount.
Same with car oil from the dipstick hole, if you do it right you get it all out.


I wouldn't take Delboy's word on that - he's full of shite sometimes. Turning it upside down still doesn't get it all, Robby is right. Pump it out, refill and pump again to get the air out.
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EazyDuz
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PostPosted: 21:53 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Islander wrote:

I wouldn't take Delboy's word on that - he's full of shite sometimes. Turning it upside down still doesn't get it all, Robby is right. Pump it out, refill and pump again to get the air out.


The way this guy does it is nothing like how it went for me:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpHpPuFMV1o

at 4:25. He did that with one hand and the spring wasnt even sticking out. On mine it was sticking out a fair bit so was much more difficult to push down hard on it, and making sure it was sat flush before tightening.
Maybe mine doesnt have OEM springs
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Tdibs
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PostPosted: 22:24 - 01 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nah depending on the model you are likely to have more spacer sticking out the top.

Dont most manuals say to air gap the fork oil level with the fork compressed (spring removed) anyhow? Need to take the forks off to do it properly imo.
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Sister Sledge
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PostPosted: 07:29 - 02 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have to remember that with Delboy he's sponsored to the hilt by various suppliers. It's quite obvious that he's going to show that a device works perfectly. Editing removes all of the failures remember..

Think of it this way: You have a bottle and want to empty it of fluid. Unfortunately the bottle also has some gears, a few springs and a bolt inside.
Tip the bottle and all of the fluid flows past the items inside and eventually drips out. Use a straw/vacuum and fluid will always gather around and under things in the bottle.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 08:14 - 02 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

Next time you do it get a 6-point socket and long extension on a T-bar. stick some tape around the hex so it jams in the socket then all you have to do it put one hand on the T-bar for pushing and turning and use the other to steady it all by holding the extension.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 20:05 - 03 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can also put a ratchet spanner on the hex then use a 2-leg puller hooked under the edge of the top-yoke to compress the top-cap as you turn it.

It's best to put something under the puller bolt to stop it marking the top cap.

If you think that's a bastard, you should try some kawasakis where it's just a steel plug you have to push in then fit a circlip above it.
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EazyDuz
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PostPosted: 16:16 - 04 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
You can also put a ratchet spanner on the hex then use a 2-leg puller hooked under the edge of the top-yoke to compress the top-cap as you turn it.

It's best to put something under the puller bolt to stop it marking the top cap.

If you think that's a bastard, you should try some kawasakis where it's just a steel plug you have to push in then fit a circlip above it.

I think the ratchet spanner might be a worthwhile investment. Most of the issue was the hand pain from the normal ratchet digging into the palm.
Anyway was well worth doing it's completely changed how the bike behaves. It was nosediving all the time before. Didn't think a change in oil would make such a dramatic difference
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ThatDippyTwat
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PostPosted: 18:24 - 04 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

EazyDuz wrote:
Delboys garage already proved that wrong.


Delboy's been proved wrong many, many times, gets butthurt, calls police, much boo-hoo'ing. The man is a fucking knobstain. Ignore anything you see on his channel, it's probably sponsored, irrespective of him declaring it or not.
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EazyDuz
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PostPosted: 12:23 - 05 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

ThatDippyTwat wrote:
EazyDuz wrote:
Delboys garage already proved that wrong.


Delboy's been proved wrong many, many times, gets butthurt, calls police, much boo-hoo'ing. The man is a fucking knobstain. Ignore anything you see on his channel, it's probably sponsored, irrespective of him declaring it or not.


Lol sounds like there is a story behind this. Was he a member here or something?
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ThatDippyTwat
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PostPosted: 17:04 - 05 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

EazyDuz wrote:
Lol sounds like there is a story behind this. Was he a member here or something?


Another channel called him on his bullshit. He got butthurt, called the police, lying through his teeth. There's video's about it. Also known for trying to get several channels nuked, video's deleted and/or demonetised.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 10:35 - 09 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

ThatDippyTwat wrote:
Another channel called him on his bullshit. He got butthurt, called the police, lying through his teeth. There's video's about it. Also known for trying to get several channels nuked, video's deleted and/or demonetised.


Links?
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 14:27 - 09 Jun 2019    Post subject: Reply with quote

How did you jack up the front?
I'm wondering as you need to push down pretty hard and with consistant pressure to thread the fork caps back on. Usual is a breeze block under the exhaust and someone to hold the back of the bike down while you push but it doesn't look like you did this.
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