Resend my activation email : Register : Log in 
BCF: Bike Chat Forums


Please help before i torch the fken thing

Reply to topic
Bike Chat Forums Index -> The Workshop
View previous topic : View next topic  
Author Message

Mr Hammers
World Chat Champion



Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Karma :

PostPosted: 18:31 - 25 May 2024    Post subject: Please help before i torch the fken thing Reply with quote

So. Three days i've wasted trying to sort the carbs out on the bandit. Three days of nice weather that i should be spending buzzing about hither and thither...but instead spent dicking around with the bastard carbs on the sodding thing. Man, i'm so pissed off with it right now.

Ok, deep breath.

Right. So it was running mostly ok, then started playing up by idling really fast, or slow to respond to throttle, and generally running a bit crap. So i pull the carbs off, give everything a damn good clean, blow out the jets etc.

Put it all back together and now it's only running on 2 and half cylinders (two pipes were 100 degrees, one about 70, and the other practically room temp).

Buy a carb repair kit. Fit new diaphrams, new jets, springs etc. Put it back on, and it runs. Sort of. It revs fine and is responsive, but shutting off the throttle causes it to drop the revs to a point where it stops completely.

It will idle, but only if you gently back off the throttle. As soon as you rev and shut off quickly, it dies.

One thing, in the new carb kit it looked like there were two main jets for each carb. As it's an aftermarket can on it thought it best to fit the bigger of the two. Now i'm not sure i should've used the smaller jets (maybe the big ones are for the 1200...?).

Could that be the cause?

I could just take it all apart yet fucking again, in fact sod it, i'll go and do that now.

But....am i missing something obvious here?

What else could cause it to die so quickly after revving?

Any help very much appreciated as the Striple is also on the naughty step as the bloody thing has yet more electrical issues (not charging this time) so i can't use that atm either. The Bandit was supposed to be the backup bike......

Cheers.
____________________
A Guide To Powerbands
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Pete.
Super Spammer



Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Karma :

PostPosted: 18:47 - 25 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Holding up idle revs is an indication of lean mixture. Diaphragms should have no part in it because the slides should be fully down at idle. It's either an intake air leak or not enough fuel.

Have you done all of the things in this thread?

https://www.banditforum.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=69488.0
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good Very Happy
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website You must be logged in to rate posts

Mr Hammers
World Chat Champion



Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Karma :

PostPosted: 19:05 - 25 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
Holding up idle revs is an indication of lean mixture. Diaphragms should have no part in it because the slides should be fully down at idle. It's either an intake air leak or not enough fuel.

Have you done all of the things in this thread?

https://www.banditforum.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=69488.0

Cheers, Pete. Apart from taking out the brass plug (which i'm a bit reluctant to do tbh, as it just introduces another variable) i've done everything else on there.

Just before taking them apart again i took it for a quick spin up the road, see how it behaves. It was sounding ok but i think slower, and then it just stopped, wouldn't start again, and i had to push the bloody thing home (and uphill too).

Before i pull them off yet again, i'm going to double check the petcock as i repaired that a little while ago...and after you said it could be fuel starvation, i'm wondering if something's up with that.
____________________
A Guide To Powerbands
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

struan80
World Chat Champion



Joined: 04 Nov 2014
Karma :

PostPosted: 19:47 - 25 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

The idle trimmer sticking?
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Pete.
Super Spammer



Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Karma :

PostPosted: 21:14 - 25 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr Hammers wrote:
Pete. wrote:
Holding up idle revs is an indication of lean mixture. Diaphragms should have no part in it because the slides should be fully down at idle. It's either an intake air leak or not enough fuel.

Have you done all of the things in this thread?

https://www.banditforum.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=69488.0

Cheers, Pete. Apart from taking out the brass plug (which i'm a bit reluctant to do tbh, as it just introduces another variable) i've done everything else on there.

Just before taking them apart again i took it for a quick spin up the road, see how it behaves. It was sounding ok but i think slower, and then it just stopped, wouldn't start again, and i had to push the bloody thing home (and uphill too).

Before i pull them off yet again, i'm going to double check the petcock as i repaired that a little while ago...and after you said it could be fuel starvation, i'm wondering if something's up with that.


Don't remove the brass plug. That's just something I did to show what was in there.
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good Very Happy
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website You must be logged in to rate posts

stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Karma :

PostPosted: 22:24 - 25 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does it have a fuel pump and is it working?
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Mr Hammers
World Chat Champion



Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Karma :

PostPosted: 10:55 - 26 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

struan80 wrote:
The idle trimmer sticking?


Ah, now...according to the Zenith website, this is an idle trimmer screw;

https://www.planetash.net/bcf/trimmer2.jpg

but i'm pretty sure it's not as that's the drain plug, as seen here;

https://www.planetash.net/bcf/carbs.jpg

These are in the bottom of the float bowl and as far as i can see have no connection to any circuit on the carb.

The idle screws i'm sure are the red circled ones. These were originally set at 2 3/4 turns out (and didn't run well). I've now set them to just 2 turns out (and still not right), but i'm not sure whether i should be turning them out more or turning them in, but more than 2 3/4 would seem a lot...?

I've replaced the main jets with the original ones as i'm not convinced the new ones were the right size tbh, so at least i know the problem isn't with them.

Pete wrote:
Don't remove the brass plug. That's just something I did to show what was in there.


Ah, good that i didn't then Smile

Stinkwheel wrote:
Does it have a fuel pump and is it working?

No, no pump, just gravity. It's a Mk1 Bandit! Very Happy
____________________
A Guide To Powerbands
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

Pete.
Super Spammer



Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Karma :

PostPosted: 11:05 - 26 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Make sure the idle circuit metering screws are all assembled correctly. Spring, washer, o-ring. If they are wrong the idle mixture will be all to hell.

BTW you are right that is a drain screw not mixture control. The idle mixture screws are the ones with the springs.

EDIT: Bandit mk1 slow running circuit diagram:
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good Very Happy
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website You must be logged in to rate posts

Mr Hammers
World Chat Champion



Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Karma :

PostPosted: 21:05 - 26 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
Make sure the idle circuit metering screws are all assembled correctly. Spring, washer, o-ring. If they are wrong the idle mixture will be all to hell.

Yes, i saw that and was very conscious of making sure i put them in correctly (looked at a parts diagram) but, i could only see one on the four idle screws i took out. I couldn't see anything left in the bottom of the other channels and tried using a pick to extract anything that might still be in there. Either there wasn't, or i couldn't see/get to them.

That said, if anything could cause the issues, that'd be a good bet i think. The pilot jets are now brand new btw, the old ones looked a bit ropey, so i don't think it's them.

Quote:
BTW you are right that is a drain screw not mixture control. The idle mixture screws are the ones with the springs.

Good to know! Incidentally, i can see the tops of the idle screws poking through into the main bore....is that normal?

It's all back together now, and i've opened the idle screws another 1 turn. Although it still idles unevenly and tries to cut off when shutting off the throttle, it seems to be better than it was. I'll go for a little ride tomorrow and see if it cuts out completely again. Hopefully not! Smile
____________________
A Guide To Powerbands
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts

WD Forte
World Chat Champion



Joined: 17 Jun 2010
Karma :

PostPosted: 23:35 - 26 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wouldn't you need to use some vac gauges to balance these carbs?

Never had me mitts on a Bandit but on most multi cylinder engines
we'd set it up to spec, (float height, mixture screws set the same
(often around 1/34 turns or so )
then finally use the gauges to fine adjust the butterflys
____________________
bikers smell of wee
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message You must be logged in to rate posts

Pete.
Super Spammer



Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Karma :

PostPosted: 08:16 - 27 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, butterflies badly out of whack can make them run very poorly. You can get them very passably balanced by holding them up to the light and matching the crescent of light around the throttle blades.
____________________
a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good Very Happy
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website You must be logged in to rate posts

Mr Hammers
World Chat Champion



Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Karma :

PostPosted: 14:33 - 27 May 2024    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
Yes, butterflies badly out of whack can make them run very poorly. You can get them very passably balanced by holding them up to the light and matching the crescent of light around the throttle blades.

That's exactly what i did, and they do look to my eye at least, like they're all in sync with each other.

Just got back from a short ride out, and although the idle is still a bit hesitant and lumpy when it's anything but up to or above temp, it is riding quite nicely...so i'll take that as a win Smile Cheers guys! Thumbs Up
____________________
A Guide To Powerbands
 Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail You must be logged in to rate posts
  Display posts from previous:   
This page may contain affiliate links, which means we may earn a small commission if a visitor clicks through and makes a purchase. By clicking on an affiliate link, you accept that third-party cookies will be set.

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Bike Chat Forums Index -> The Workshop All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Page 1 of 1

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

Read the Terms of Use! - Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group
 

Debug Mode: ON - Server: birks (www) - Page Generation Time: 0.10 Sec - Server Load: 0.59 - MySQL Queries: 16 - Page Size: 84.9 Kb