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De-tune race bike

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Ben.
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PostPosted: 20:34 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: De-tune race bike Reply with quote

Class limit is 130bhp and I've got 145bhp from the motor.
Spoke to my local tuner and he said he can over fuel it to get to the power limit but it will make it jerky and horrible to ride.
Any other suggestions from the BCF lot? how can i de-tune the motor but still get a nice ride without flat spots etc.
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lihp
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PostPosted: 20:39 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you have different camshafts available to you?
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Barry_M2
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PostPosted: 20:45 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll be in rookie 1000's this year too Ben
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robocog
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PostPosted: 20:46 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

adjust the throttle stop whilst on the dyno?

If thats too temporary (could be adjusted on track and then reset) or cannot be lockwired/sealed- so you don't get accused of rule breaking...washers in the inlet ? (though a nice set of alloy gas flowed restrictors would possibly be better)

Can the timing be adjusted by an ECU or rev limited perhaps?..you dont have a lot of HP to loose ...just dyno it on a hot day with an un oiled chain I bet you wouldn't be far off

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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 20:48 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why not just return bits to stock until you're inside the power limit, then fuel it properly.
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G
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PostPosted: 20:48 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

robocog wrote:

Can the timing be adjusted by an ECU or rev limited perhaps?..you dont have a lot of HP to loose ...just dyno it on a hot day with an un oiled chain I bet you wouldn't be far off

Won't help if you're pulled off after race and your bike is dynod.

Once I got the later cams in my curvy SV, Steve Jordan added some tape over the air intake to bring it back down to the class hp limit as he'd got a bit too high setup right.
Seemed to do the job well enough.
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 20:48 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

surely if he just overfuels it at the peak RPM it'll make it just fine to ride? What bike? FI? If it's carbs, ignore.
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DrDonnyBrago
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PostPosted: 20:48 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Re: De-tune race bike Reply with quote

How modified is it at the moment? Any stock parts you can switch back to?
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Mikey3
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PostPosted: 21:11 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:

Once I got the later cams in my curvy SV.


I've looked into this... what gains do you get from it? Seen on the SV forum people doing it and it looked interesting.
Mike
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 21:13 - 24 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rev limit seems like a good bet to me. Wonder if that can be set in the ECU?
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Welshd1k
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PostPosted: 01:02 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

restrict the airflow ? like a normal 'restrictor'?
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G
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PostPosted: 01:12 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

mredhead wrote:

I've looked into this... what gains do you get from it? Seen on the SV forum people doing it and it looked interesting.
Mike

64hp up to 67.5hp set up properly on Steve Jordan's dyno stock internals, but with K&N and full M4 race system.
Forget the exact figures, but after the cams it got up to a restricted 72.8hp on his dyno, I think it was.

Personally, wouldn't bother unless you're actually racing - definitely going up from 64hp to 72hp (I had one or two races at the mid-point) was a big difference that made I had more chance of staying with others on the straight and putting a pass in under braking.

On the road or even trackdays, afraid we're in polishing turd sort of territory. If you want a faster bike, buy one. If you want to go faster on your current bike, turn the throttle earlier Smile.
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 01:27 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

How standard is the bike?

From the figures you have given you need to lose 10% which is a fair amount from a bodge on fueling, or anything like that. You could possible knock a bit off by retarding the ignition a touch. Open the valve clearances up to the wide end of the range.

Not sure on the R1 system, but can the EXUP valve be mal adjusted to stop it opening fully.

All the best

Keith
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G
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PostPosted: 02:20 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it was FI, I'd definitely be looking to just limit the power at the top end, so you you've got more time at 130hp.
Unfortunately you don't have the flexibility you might have.

It may be worth working out a plan of action, then getting it set up on the dyno used in the series, presuming there is one present - that way you don't have to worry about other's over-reading etc.
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Ben.
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PostPosted: 15:16 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Barry_M2 wrote:
I'll be in rookie 1000's this year too Ben


oo really. send me a pm. Im doing tunderbikes this year but we should be at the same meets.
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Ben.
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PostPosted: 15:17 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big_Ham wrote:
Why not just return bits to stock until you're inside the power limit, then fuel it properly.


that would mean replacing the engine for a stock one which would set me back £750.
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Ben.
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PostPosted: 15:20 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Re: De-tune race bike Reply with quote

DonnyBrago wrote:
How modified is it at the moment? Any stock parts you can switch back to?


Apparently its got a skimmed head / re-flowed.
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Ben.
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PostPosted: 15:22 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kickstart wrote:
Hi

How standard is the bike?

From the figures you have given you need to lose 10% which is a fair amount from a bodge on fueling, or anything like that. You could possible knock a bit off by retarding the ignition a touch. Open the valve clearances up to the wide end of the range.

Not sure on the R1 system, but can the EXUP valve be mal adjusted to stop it opening fully.

All the best

Keith


This is what Steve Jordan suggested but he said it would be lumpy with flat spots everywhere and it would be banging and popping on the over run.
No ex-up on a race exhaust.
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 15:58 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

Anything done to excess will cause issues.

However you could probably get back more than the cost of a stock engine by selling the tuned one (assuming it was done by someone competent).

Small bit of ignition retard might lose you 5% or so without any major issues. Stick on a stock exhaust to finish the job, and tweak the timing if the exhaust goes too far. Plus point is that you will probably gain a bit more mid range to help you recover when you make a mistake.

All the best

Keith
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garth
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PostPosted: 16:10 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or just change the head, no biggy.
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Mikey3
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PostPosted: 20:27 - 25 Jan 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:

64hp up to 67.5hp set up properly on Steve Jordan's dyno stock internals, but with K&N and full M4 race system.
Forget the exact figures, but after the cams it got up to a restricted 72.8hp on his dyno, I think it was.

Personally, wouldn't bother unless you're actually racing - definitely going up from 64hp to 72hp (I had one or two races at the mid-point) was a big difference that made I had more chance of staying with others on the straight and putting a pass in under braking.

On the road or even trackdays, afraid we're in polishing turd sort of territory. If you want a faster bike, buy one. If you want to go faster on your current bike, turn the throttle earlier Smile.


It did seem a big job for not much of a gain; in everyday use of course.
I'm happy on my SV Smile (except my restriction) but I think its unfair to complain about it until I am more able than the bike
Mike
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