Problem installing engine bars on ER-6N

[sapstar]

I bought Renntec engine bars for my 2015 Kawasaki ER-6N and installed them today

The bars came with all nuts and bolts necessary, except for the right side, behind the fairing, just in front of the engine. The instructions suggest I need to use the existing bolts which were taken out. In my case the existing bolts continuously spin and I can't tighten them. These are 2 M8x60 bolts. See picture below from installation instructions.

https://i.ibb.co/hFLzyXr/20200229-210652.jpg

Can someone please let me know what kind of bolts I need to buy to replace these? I checked in ebay and see a number of different types of bolts and unable to decide which ones are right.

Eventhough the bolts are spinning when I tighten them, the fitting seems to be sturdy and there is no movement. Is the bike drivable in this condition?

Also anyone know if the nuts behind these bolts are removable? If so I would like to replace them too.

Found these on ebay.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/233275990803
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/362217874580
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/362293650219
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/372090349564
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First/Current Bike - Kawasaki ER-6N

[Nobby the Bastard]

[sapstar]

[NJD]

[stinkwheel]

Damage to the threads on the bolts should be obvious when you look at it. If the thread on the bolts is ok, the captive nuts may be damaged.

You've got most of it. they are called "flange bolts". I'd go for high tensile steel if they are attaching an engine mount to the frame like it looks in the picture. The ones there appezar to be part-threaded.

The ones in your third link down would be ideal and I have used that seller on several occasions.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FLANGED-HEXAGON-BOLTS-HIGH-TENSILE-8-8-PLATED-STEEL-FLANGE-HEX-SCREWS-M6-M8-M10/362293650219

If the captive nuts are damaged, you might be able to get slightly longer bolts and use a nut on the end of them.

If they are holding an engine mount and are loose, I would not ride the bike.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[sapstar]

Thanks @NJD @stinkwheel.

I didn't see any obvious damage on the threads. I have some fully thread M8x70mm bolts at home. I will try these first to identify if it is the nut or the bolt which is stripped. If they work, then I will buy the m8x60mm. If not, I will get m8x70mm along with nuts to secure on the other side.

Will the zink plated bolts be ok outdoors? One of the links I posted is A4-80 stainless steel which is supposed to be high tensile and corrosion resistant. Would these be better?
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First/Current Bike - Kawasaki ER-6N

[sapstar]

Tried another brand new m8 bolt I have and it does the same. So I think its definitely the welded nut on the back which got stripped.

I am able to get high tensile bolts in toolstation so I can finish the job today. These are fully threaded though. Is there an issue using fully threaded instead of the part threaded bolts?
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First/Current Bike - Kawasaki ER-6N

[doggone]

[sapstar]

[sapstar]

Thanks for your help guys. The stock bolts were out enough on the back to take a nut. So I just left the stock bolts and added nuts on the back to be able to tighten them fully. All sorted now .
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First/Current Bike - Kawasaki ER-6N

[stinkwheel]

One caveat. You MIGHT want to use some sort of locking device (either a spring washer or a nylok nut) to prevent them rattling loose. That said, the bolt didn't have one so it shouldn't if it's done up to the correct tension as per the owners manual.

I would always use high tensile steel over stainless in this application. It's load bearing and acting in shear. Stainless is unpredictable in its strength (even within the same grade) and can harden and become brittle with time/work/temperature/weathering.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[sapstar]

[NJD]

[sapstar]

@NJD thanks very much for the helpful advise. I have now ordered a torque wrench like you suggested and some 1/2" impact sockets to go with it.

I wasn't even aware of tightening the bolts to a specific torque setting... . First job I took up on my bike myself and learnt a lot from it...

From the below table can someone advise the right torque setting for these bolts on both sides?
https://i.ibb.co/qxHX3n5/Screenshot-2020-03-02-at-12-14-21.png

There are 2 bolts on the right and 2 on the left. I am guessing these are the Front engine mounting bolt (Left - 44nm, Right - 49nm) and Rear engine mounting bolt (Left - 44nm, Right - 44nm). Is this correct?

Also I replace the following bolt just above brake pedal on the right and the same location on the left. What is this bolt called. so I can find the right torque setting?

https://i.ibb.co/tPJrcXH/Screenshot-2020-03-02-at-12-18-58.png
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First/Current Bike - Kawasaki ER-6N

[NJD]

Providing that this -- https://mototh.com/files/kawasaki/ER6n/Kawasaki-ER6n-Service-Manual-EN.pdf -- is the correct year of your bike then as below.

8-2 in that manual for better image quality.

https://i.postimg.cc/nctw0sxZ/123.png

https://i.postimg.cc/x1fpVWq4/1234.png

~

"Impact sockets" are made to be used on an impact gun, or alike. Mainly because they withstand more brutal force than a regular socket and therefore loosen extremely stuck nuts/bolts. Nothing wrong with using them without an impact gun, but perhaps useless for regular use unless only type of socket you have in that size.

I'd stick to using regular 1/2 sockets on that torque wrench unless budget is tight. Always handy to keep impact sockets for future use, though.

~

As for that bolt you picture look at manual above for the "frame" section and see if you can spot it. Looks like a small Allen head bolt with a collar, can't imagine very tight.
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The do it all, T̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶r̶o̶k̶e̶n̶ ̶o̶n̶e̶,̶ ̶T̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶i̶g̶ ̶l̶u̶m̶p̶,̶ ̶C̶h̶o̶n̶g̶ ̶N̶o̶o̶d̶l̶e̶

[sapstar]

Thanks @NJD. I found the relevant section for the 2015 ER-6N (The one in the picture is the model prior to 2012). The torque settings are 25 on the left and 30 on the right. The torque wrench I bought only starts at 27.... I am going to do 27 on the left and 30 on the right.
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First/Current Bike - Kawasaki ER-6N

[NJD]

27 Nm on a 25 Nm torque setting is over torquing it, and that's how things like that welded nut on the back of the bracket become rounded and useless. Its not by much, and I imagine you may get away with it, but not a habit to get into.

25 Nm and 30 Nm can be done by hand, and I'd go with a 1/4 ratchet and the appropriate socket or hex bit etc. Seat it all the way in and then give it a couple of <insert word> on the ratchet to tighten it.

Practice on the 30 Nm one first, tighten it as much as you'd go by hand until it feels like time to stop and then use the torque wrench to see how close you are; and then you'll know if you can do the left hand one without the torque wrench confidently. You'll know if you came close as the torque wrench will "click" instantly.

Be sure to learn how to set the torque wrench up before trying it on the bike first.

If you've got some brake cleaner then clean the threads out where the bolt goes into, and the thread bolt if you can. Loctite on the bolt if needed (sparkling clean first). Cotton buds may help on the internal thread. There is a drill attachment etc perfect for internal threads but that's OTT here.

Whole reason for a torque wrench here is the importance of what its doing: holding the engine in place. Tightening it to right spec will prevent them from vibrating loose over the course of rides and moving about in the frame in a way that it shouldn't -- to the extreme end if not mounted properly.

Better to er on the side of caution, and check bolt after one or two rides than to over tighten and end up at garage asking for them to repair the thread (not difficult but half an hours labour not spend is a good habit to get into).

Use nail varnish to put a dot on the head of the bolt and on the frame of the bike in line with each other once done, and then you'll be able to see if one has moved that its come loose.
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The do it all, T̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶r̶o̶k̶e̶n̶ ̶o̶n̶e̶,̶ ̶T̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶i̶g̶ ̶l̶u̶m̶p̶,̶ ̶C̶h̶o̶n̶g̶ ̶N̶o̶o̶d̶l̶e̶

[sickpup]

How do you strip an m8 thread without noticing?

[sapstar]

Thanks @NJD. Followed your instructions and hand tightened the left to roughly 25nm I think and the right to 30 using the torque wrench. I didn't bother removing the nuts again to put the glue, but next time it is in service, I will as the garage to do it properly.

@sickpup this is the first time I am doing any work on the bike myself. The bolts were not budging when I tried to unscrew them. So I used an impact driver I have. This got the bolts out, but unfortunately stripped the nuts. Atleast this is a good learning for me.
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First/Current Bike - Kawasaki ER-6N

[Nobby the Bastard]

[sapstar]

[Nobby the Bastard]

There no way you would have stripped the thread buy undoing it. Only overtightening them strips them.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha:"Remember this simple rule - scooters are for men who like to feel the breeze on their huge, flapping cunt lips."
Triumph Sprint ST 1050